Dead Joggler, white flashing screen

[sijones]

Hi All, it's been ages since I've posted here (mainly 'cos my two Jogglers have been behaving themselves).

This week the one in my study running PnPIII died - don't know why: I'm not aware we've had a power cut (this particular one HATES not being shut down properly).

The unit appears dead - when I power it up the screen remains totally black, except for a full-screen white flash every 3 seconds. Between white flashes, the screen goes back to black again. No O2 logo, nothing.

Have tried reflashing the OpenPeak image (as a precursor to reinstalling PnPIII), but no joy. Have also tried Roobarb's reflashing tool, both from a stick, and using the USB-hub-&-keyboard-typing-blindly technique, with no results. The LED on the sticks doesn't illuminate at all, suggesting the Joggler isn't trying to access them. I've used the sticks with this Joggler before, and it's accepted a flash from them.

Can anyone suggest what's going on? I've never seen this before. I found this thread: http://www.jogglerwiki.com/forum/viewto ... ing+screen, but it doesn't look like it ever got an answer. Any suggestions would be gratefully received. I miss the internet radio in the study!

Simon

[offbeatdave]

Have you tried swapping over power supplies? I had one fail once which resulted in black and white screen corruption.

[sijones]

Ooooo... that never crossed my mind. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll switch them over when I get home tonight & see what happens. More news as it breaks!

[sijones]

Unfortunately, switching power supplies made no difference.

After this experiment, I rebooted the downstairs Joggler (the 'good' one) and noticed that it made an identical white screen-flash - but only once, immediately before the O2 screen came up.

So the 'bad' Joggler seems to be doing the pre-O2 screen white flash - but over & over again, about once every 3 seconds.

Anyone got any other thoughts? Maybe it's time I retired this Joggler - it's always been a bit fragile.

(It's weird - the other one is much more robust - recovers from having its power cut, accepts flashes with good grace, etc.)

[pete]

I have seen this with "cold" jogglers; sometimes even after booting to a regular O2 screen.

The above noted I have also seen the LCD connectors come loose. You could also take apart your Joggler and check the fittings on both sides of the LCD cables. Push them in even though they look to be fine. There is a piece of yellowtape over them.

[roobarb!]

After this experiment, I rebooted the downstairs Joggler (the 'good' one) and noticed that it made an identical white screen-flash - but only once, immediately before the O2 screen came up.

Don't worry - that's normal. You're just hyper-sensitive to it now!

So the 'bad' Joggler seems to be doing the pre-O2 screen white flash - but over & over again, about once every 3 seconds.

Anyone got any other thoughts? Maybe it's time I retired this Joggler - it's always been a bit fragile.

(It's weird - the other one is much more robust - recovers from having its power cut, accepts flashes with good grace, etc.)

It could be corrupt data in the EFI chip - that would probably result in something that looked like this. Does it ever show a logo, or does it just keep flashing the white screen?

There are definitely some hardware 'personalities' in the Joggler world.

[pete]

The test for a corrupt EFI chip would be just a swap to see if it boots in the non booting joggler.

That said if it does then write a new EFI chip booting with the good one and hot swapping the bad one carefully.

[sijones]

Thanks for the replies gents.

It could be corrupt data in the EFI chip - that would probably result in something that looked like this. Does it ever show a logo, or does it just keep flashing the white screen?

Nope, no logo - just a black screen with a white flash every 3 secs.

Following Pete's previous post, I opened up the Joggler (I could tell I wasn't the first person to have been in there). I reseated the large silver multi-pin connectors (I'm assuming they're the LCD connectors). This didn't make any difference, but when I rebooted the Joggler, with the screen just laid to the side, I could see a green LED inside the case. This lights up, but extinguishes every 3 seconds, at the same time that the screen flashes white.

I might steel myself to swap the chip over with the other Joggler (or I may wimp out, for fear of wrecking the other Joggler). I've looked around the forum, but couldn't find any pics of the guts of the Joggler so I can establish what the EFI chip looks like. I'm guessing it's on the back of the main board, which would need removing from the rear case of the Joggler? If any pics exist I'd be grateful if someone could point me in the right direction.

Here's a thought - I haven't attempted an OS that runs directly off a USB stick (I've read on here about Mint Linux, for instance). Is it worth trying that to see if the EFI chip is truly knackered?

[ilovemyjoggler]

Is this what you're after? As always, the post is thanks to pete.

http://www.jogglerwiki.com/forum/viewto ... 460#p14341

[sijones]

Is this what you're after?

http://www.jogglerwiki.com/forum/viewto ... 460#p14341

Thanks - perfect! Just need some Dutch courage now...

[monkums]

Here's a thought - I haven't attempted an OS that runs directly off a USB stick (I've read on here about Mint Linux, for instance). Is it worth trying that to see if the EFI chip is truly knackered?

Definitely worth a try as I have had a Joggler die on me which now runs Squeeze OS happily from a USB stick.

[pete]

Yup the one Mb EFI chip (EFI Bios?) is an easy swap and test. You just need to go slow and be careful.

The onboard Gb flash memory chip is soldered into place. The first EFI boot partition on the 1Gb what decides what is going to boot.

Thinking too that the EFI boot FAT partition on the 1Gb flash soldered memory initially checks for a USB boot stick or internal flash.

The EFI boot flash chip always points to that partition to look and boot. (hence the big or little initial boot logo)

I have wiped that first EFI fat partition a few times in my "experimenting". I do not see anything on the screen if that partition is wiped.

I have fixed it by replacing the EFI boot BIOS chip with a Seabios boot chip; booting into XP and writing the old O2 Joggler stuff back to the Gb soldered on chip then replacing the EFI boot Mb chip with the original one.

[sijones]

I have fixed it by replacing the EFI boot BIOS chip with a Seabios boot chip; booting into XP and writing the old O2 Joggler stuff back to the Gb soldered on chip then replacing the EFI boot Mb chip with the original one.

Eeeek! That's probably beyond my meagre skills!

Thanks for the continued replies everyone. So in this order I reckon I'll:
- See if it'll play nice with an OS booting from a stick (will go with Squeezeplay OS, as monkums suggested. The downstairs Joggler's running that, and it works great). If memory serves, this particular Joggler is fussy about running off a stick - it's a long time since I tried it - but I'll give it a go.
- If that doesn't work, might gird up my loins for swapping the small EFI chip with the other Joggler (though this gives me the slight heebie-jeebies). I've seen the procedure described elsewhere on the forum.
- After that I guess I've nothing to lose by trying to swap out the larger chip - as the Joggler would be destined for the spares bin anyway. At that point I'll be pestering to know where to buy a Seabios chip.

Will report back with a progress update!
cheers,
Simon

[pete]

pete wrote:I have fixed it by replacing the EFI boot BIOS chip with a Seabios boot chip; booting into XP and writing the old O2 Joggler stuff back to the Gb soldered on chip then replacing the EFI boot Mb chip with the original one.

The rewrite of the 1Gb firmware is something you would maybe do if you toasted the boot EFI partition of the boot chip. That is an unlikely occurrence. I did it by formatting the entire Gb partition. Normally this would be a last measure. Remember that the boot chip is a 1Mb socketed chip and the firmware is a 2Gb soldered on chip. (much different).

Fixing a corrupt boot 1Mb flash chip in the socket is way easier. You can use your good booting Joggler to do this. If you purchase a spare chip then you have a spare chip to fall back to.

It is easier than you think. My original fears related to leaving the heat sink off for a time of testing and not shorting anything.

I replaced the ice maker in a relatively new (5 years old) refrigerator following a step by step process.

Other than sticking my head in the freezer for a time and low WAF; it was relatively easy.

You can make an EFI boot up chip (you will not really need a Seabios boot chip). I purchased the "blank" chips here in the US for some $4.00 USD each. I think you can purchase them over there in the UK for a similiar price. Basically while the Joggler is opened and the motherboard is unattached to the rear of the case you

1 - boot up.
2 - remove the good boot chip while the Joggler is on and open.
3 - place the new boot chip in the same socket.
4 - write the boot flash to it
5 - remove it and
6 - replace chip with the original booting chip

Takes a couple of minutes. (time traveler time)

Think of it as a relatively (well mostly) non invasive means of a resuscitation of your Joggler.

[sijones]

Resurrecting my own ancient thread with a bit of new info, just in case anyone can shed any light.

Recap: One of my Jogglers failed - wouldn't start up, only a black screen with a white flash every few seconds. Wouldn't accept a reflash, or boot another OS from an external USB. Swapped power supplies from my other Joggler to no avail. Disconnected & reseated various internal cables - no improvement.

The last resort was to do the EFI chip hot-swap cure, but I was unwilling to risk my only other (working) Joggler that was in daily use as a Squeezeplayer. So the dead Joggler went into a cupboard for 2 years.

Anyway, I recently acquired a new (to me) working Joggler to play with, so I thought I'd dust off the dead one too, and see if I could fix it. My plan was to try the EFI chip swap-&-reflash procedure that I'd read about.

I cracked them both open and learned how to remove the EFI chips. Before I got involved in any hot-swap drama, I just thought I'd swap the chips over & start them normally to see what happened. Long story short: both chips worked fine in the new 'good' Joggler. Neither chip worked in the 'bad' Joggler. So I concluded I didn't have an EFI chip problem after all.

So there we go... Does anyone know of anything else that can cause my symptoms now I've ruled out the EFI chip?

PS Happy New Year!

[pete]

Happy New Year!

Check to make sure the LCD cable is tightly in to place.

It is a tight connection there and I have seen go a bit crooked sometimes.

[hawsey]

Happy New year this should get you going with a dead joggler , see Roobarbs site .

http://birdslikewires.co.uk/openframe-flash

Particularly this section

Attach a keyboard and your memory stick to the Joggler through a USB hub.Turn on your Joggler and immediately begin pressingESCAPE repeatedly for around 10 seconds.Type fs0: and press RETURN. You won’t see any text on screen.Type boot.nsh and press RETURN.

I found one keyboard wouldn't work , but another did , also you can build your reflash stick first an check it starts to boot up first on your good Joggler .
Then stick it in to port 4 of a USB hub ( don't ask why ) and the wired keyboard in to another port .
You will get it going using this method I am sure
Good luck

[sijones]

Hi Gents - thanks for the replies! I'll try both of those suggestions tonight & will report back. I've actually done both of them before, but that was 2 years ago, no harm in trying again.

One thing I can be very confident of is that my USB memory sticks with reflash images are OK, as I have a 'good' Joggler to try them in now, and they work fine. In fact my new 'good' Joggler is already reflashed as a Squeezeplay client with Roobarb's excellent internal image: the flashing went like a breeze & it's running lovely so far. (I asked Santa for an external USB sound card for Christmas, and I must have been good all year as I received one. Next little job is to hook it up to the new Joggler).

More news as it breaks!

[sijones]

Hmmmm... no joy.

It strikes me that the USB port isn't powering up the USB stick in the first place. You know how you'd expect the little light in the stick to glow as it's being accessed? Not on this Joggler...

Here's a barmy idea... could I open it up again and put the reflashing stick in the internal USB port, either directly or through a hub? I guess that would tell me if the external USB socket is damaged?

Might try that next - there's nothing much to lose with this one!

[hawsey]

Try the blind boot thing on your good Joggler first maybe , good idea about internal though , try a different hub as well